Chick Flick?

[GiGi]

What in the hell makes something a "chick flick"?

Anytime I ever try to write something with a female lead, my guy pals say "oh it's a chick flick". As if to say "EW! Estrogen! Run for the woods!"

I mean, why does a guy have to be the central character for it to be "cool". I fail to classify movies on it's gender makeup, only if it touches me, entertains me, is unique and different etc. Is this a general feeling or is it just the people of whom I am asking their opinions?

While I am proud of being a woman, there is something so frightening about investing everything in something that might be labled such, and it stinks. Chick flick can mean 'cheese', right?

There are obvious movies that might jump off a page as this label,
but here is a secret: I don't know ANYONE who rushes to the theater to see the latest mooshy typical formula love story. None of my GF's in fact. They seek out a myriad of genres and no one I know has seen "how to Lose a Guy in 10 Days". Love stories ccan be cool, when they are told differently and uniquely. And even then, why does something about love get labled a girlie film?
Note: I have yet to write love stories, just slice of life dramas and such.

I don't know if the label bothers me worse or the implications behind what it means that can be very negative and I WONT get into it because this is not meant to be a discussion about how men/women are different. I don't believe in that, just that people are different. I digress...

SO, what makes a "chick flick"?
And, is it a "bad thing"?
And for the males, is there something that is called "a chick flick" that you like and don't care who knows it? :)

Just a little research!

[Jason]

I think a chick flick is the same thing as a steven seagal movie. GI Joe and Barbie - same...but different.

[Momentarylogic]

I am afraid of lawsuits

And, bannas taste good in warm milk.

[El Duderino Diablo]

Ah yes. Chick flicks. The gentler sex equivilent to the straight to video action flick except you can still get a current A list actors to appear in the absolute worst "chick flick" and expect to get a widespread theatrical release. I think the only thing that keeps them from going straight to video is the belief that as "dramas" they supposedly carry more credibility than an equivilent genre flick. That and the studios know the sort of people that depend on a certain amount of emotional masochism to get through the week (the same people who desperately depend on offerings from Lifetime, We, Oxygen and W) will happily shell out several dollars to see the same stories rehashed with increasingly fresher faces.

Maybe your friends are having trouble differentiating between a chick flick and a quality drama or comedy with a female lead.
Neither Ghost World nor Amelie are chick flicks. I don't think anyone I know would consider them as such. Well, okay one redneck friend in Alberta would definitely consider them chick flicks but what the hell does he know.
Would your friends consider any of the Alien movies, Buffy the Vampire Slayer or (feh) the Lara Croft: Tombraider movies to be chick flicks?

[Furious D]

Here's a simple guide to determine whether the film you're watching is a chick flick or guy movie.

1a. Character dies....
of a terminal Illness/ in a senseless accident / or while giving birth
Chick Flick

1b. Character dies...
With both guns blazing/ in an explosion/ or while being eaten by an alien from the inside.
Guy Flick

2a. The character has to get to a wedding because...
She's still in love with the groom and she doesn't want him to marry the snobby socialite who is mean to children and puppies.
Chick Flick

2b. The character has to get to a wedding because...
There's a bomb underneath the altar and if it goes off it will kill half the population of Chicago.
Guy Flick

3a. If it stars Kate Hudson.
Chick Flick

3b. If it stars Ah-Nold
Guy Flick

4a. Character discovers...
That her mother loves her, she just couldn't show it very well due to her harsh upbringing
Chick Flick

4b. Character discovers...
That his mother is an alien and now he's being hunted by intergalactic bounty hunters that can only be defeated by his mastery of Cosmic Kung-Fu and a spaceship from the planet Fubar 9.
Guy Flick

I hope this helps.

[El Duderino Diablo]

You know, Furious, I'm looking at 1b. 2b. 3b. and 4b. and thinking you may have the beginnings of a screenplay there.
;)

[Furious D]

Originally posted by The Dude
You know, Furious, I'm looking at 1b. 2b. 3b. and 4b. and thinking you may have the beginnings of a screenplay there.
;)

Don't touch that script! IT'S MY PRECIOUS!!;) :p



Addendum to the test:

5a. Two women hugging...
Chick Flick

5b. Two women kissing...
Guy Flick

If you've got your own additions to this simple test, let me know.

[GiGi]

Good replies, I got some chuckles! :)

Dude, oh Yoda of the film world, you are wise. :)

Furious D: great points...but a couple points to differ...
When Dustin Hoffman died on that bus next to Jon Voight in "Midnight COwboy"...how come that wasn't a chick flick? :) Or when Apollo Creed was killed as Rocky watch helplessly? Or, blah blah, blah "masculine movie of choice insert here!" So could it be just a lil tad smidgen bias if say a woman was in those roles or situations?

There are also a lot of movies where Father/relations are explored. I can think of the recent "Monster's Ball" where Billy Bob basically drove his boy to suicide. I thought, what a prick, he really hated his kid. Then you find out he couldnt express his emotions to the boy because of how he was raised by his own ingornant and racist Father.

Now, not meaning to argue, but for every point that might designate a chick flick I could probably offer a guy flick alternative. I suppose it is up to the individual viewer on how they percieve a film and have a right to call it whatever they want. I guess I'm more in amazement of why chick flicks arent cool and men run screaming from the theater if they think something is just that. :)
(and im not talkign about the pre-packaged terrible rehashed cheesy chick flicks that we have seen a million time in a million ways...but lets say something liek a great story like "Color Purple" It is foever damned a chick flick. Spielberg does NOT make chick flicks...how darest thou! heheh)

Oddly enough, Dude, I was thinking how the average guy would classify "alien" or "tombraider" since they have action hero but female leads.


Oooh! Side rant! 2 women kissing! I know the guys arent sick of seeing this, but this is a very cheap thing hollywood is doing now. Has nothing to do with story or plotlines or lesbian tolerence, it has to do with cheap draw and sex appeal. I say leave porn in porn and real art to movie making :) haha!

Thanks all. Damn it's COLD

[Pete Vonder Haar]

I think the problem is that "chick flick" and "formulaic romantic comedy" have become synonymous, and not altogether fairly.

People lump movies about relationships and personal interaction into the "chick" category because it's easy. Admittedly, not a hell of a lot of 15-year old males are going to be lining up to see the "Bridget Jones" sequel, but intelligent filmmaking should transcend this kind of facile generalization.

How much of this is socialization? How many women and/or men shy away from martial arts films or war movies or (conversely) period dramas or romances because they've been taught their whole lives that members of their particular gender shouldn't patronize such films?

Look at how these movies are marketed, and to whom, and you'll get your answer.

[GiGi]

Understood :) Of course, me being a WWII genre freak or get into just about all war movies, I can say that isn't me. But yes, I can see what you are saying. A target audience is intended for certain type of films; assuming a group of female friends will indeed go see the Bridget Jones sequel while the guys will go see the next big action film. So maybe we can blame it on marketing and gender generalization that has just become accepted as ordinary movie lingo. Sadly I think that handicaps the average movie goer (not the diehards on here who overlook stereotypes because they are into movies for far more than entertainment value).

The big problem is a film with a female lead, that does not involve an action plot has a prejudice to begin with. I think there are some dandy 'chick' filmmakers out there who get overlooked because of this.

Im really pleased with the open comments about this :) Thanks!

[Furious D]

Originally posted by GiGi

Furious D: great points...but a couple points to differ...
When Dustin Hoffman died on that bus next to Jon Voight in "Midnight COwboy"...how come that wasn't a chick flick? :) Or when Apollo Creed was killed as Rocky watch helplessly? Or, blah blah, blah "masculine movie of choice insert here!" So could it be just a lil tad smidgen bias if say a woman was in those roles or situations?

Thanks all. Damn it's COLD

All kidding aside there is a phenomena that I call the 'Macho Chick Flick.' These are films that use many of the elements found in so-called 'Chick Flicks' but are geared toward a male audience.

Now they don't appeal to the purient side of the male mind, like that whole kissing women issue. Instead they rely on themes of 'male-bonding.' Those are strong friendships based on a shared facing of some adversity. They can be disease, (examples-MIDNIGHT COWBOY & BRIAN'S SONG) but more likely they're external pressures, like poverty, war, or sports competitions.

You also get a mixing of these themes like Midnight Cowboy, Rocky # Whatever, and Brian's Song.

The 'external pressure or threat's' important because, as someone wise once said, "Men do things side by side. Women do them face to face." Now that's a generalization, but it is accurate in many things. Hence the Buddy Picture showing opposites becoming brothers by facing adversity side by side. Or the same adversity could tear them apart like in many dramas.

Look at John Woo's pre-Hollywood HK flicks. They're sort of the classic archetype of this movie.:D

PS: IT'S DAMN COLD HERE TOO!!!:eek:

[AmyLynnBest]

Have you seen the new "Chick Flick" box set out in stores like Best Buy? I can't remember all of the title, but I do know "Ever After" and "Say Anything" are in there.

I've seen Chick Flick defined as a movie you can take a 17-25 year old female to and be sure to get laid after.

[Ellen M.]

WOW!... Good discussion folks.
While I think there's a definite "Chick Flick" genre, I also think they run the gamut.

Let's see, you've got "tweener" films ala Hillary Duff & Mandy Moore, "coming of age" films (basically anything with Kirsten Dunst & Julia Stiles), "just plain corny & bad" films that typically star Julia Roberts & Sandra Bullock, the "arty" ones that are based on female urban fiction & usually have indie stars like Parker Posey, the "highbrow" stuff, which are mostly films produced by Merchant / Ivory, and finally, the "menopause" films with greats like Meryl Streep, Diane Keaton, Kathy Bates, and a host of older British actresses. I do agree that there are a few female-driven films that break the mold ("Amelie", "Ghost World", "Secretary" & "Thirteen" are a few good examples).

Luckily, I'm involved with a great guy, who's a manly-man that likes a good "guy movie", but will also go see a "chick flick" with me (although he HATED "The Hours" & still gives me shit about it).

Just curious, but what about the films that legends like Katherine Hepburn, Joan Crawford & Lana Turner did... were those considered "chick flicks" back in the day, or just good movies?

Ellen ;)

[GiGi]

I hate to admit it, but a chick flick box set is kinda a cute idea! Thanks for the heads up, Amy.

Ellen, that's a pretty good list of movies that might fit that description. :)

And Furious, just had to say I agree and see what you are saying. If only the viewing world could be as open as everyone here!

Ps...stop sending cold air down here! :)

[Seedy Edgewick]

There's a belief among the monied Hollywood population that certain people want certain things in their films. Unfortunately, they're right more often than they're wrong.

A "chick flick" would be any production that panders to what the suits believe the female audience wants. Inconsequential elements such as creative storytelling, compelling characters, and cinematic artistry are cast aside in favor of a particular leading lady/man or a contrived romance. They are the celluloid equivalent of a Harlequin romance novel.

You'll see common threads running throughout them, the most prominent of which is the "romantic longing." This is a situation in which one (or both) people come to realize how much they care for the other. In some cases, the entire movie revolves around the romantic longing. In others, the longing develops over time and is only revealed during the "happy ending."

(Side note: I had a happy ending the other day, and it had nothing to do with chick flicks.)

Other threads include: tortured history with parent(s), past trauma never dealt with, and coming of age. All of these threads deal with emotions, and the aforementioned suits believe that women only want to deal with emotions in the movies. Essentially, a "chick flick" panders to the (perceived) lowest common denominator of its intended audience.

It is possible for a film to be female-centric WITHOUT being a chick flick -- it must deal with female issues without pandering. Such films are few and far between because the suits don't feel they're profitable. They must attach some kind of gimmick to the female story (such as Patrick Swayze in "Dirty Dancing") in order to make money. You don't usually see a non-pandering female-centric film outside of the indie scene.

How many films have you seen that fit the following criteria:
(1) It must have more than one woman in it
(2) who actually TALK to each other
(3) about something other than a man.
If you think about it, "Alien" meets all three. In it, the two women talk about the monster.

Oh, and it's 70 degrees and sunny all week out here in the desert.

[Ellen M.]

Seedy...

A - Hope the "happy ending" was a good one.

B - "Kissing Jessica Stein" comes to mind, based on your list of questions... but it was rather indie.

C - The warm desert beats the shit out of the freezing midwest any day!

Ellen ;)

[El Duderino Diablo]

Mmm... Betty Page. What was the topic again?

[Rory L. Aronsky]

What was that about Betty Page? Wha....

*sinks into the same mental barrage of Betty Page images that The Dude is probably dealing with too. Aaaaahhhhhhhh*

[Ellen M.]

Yeay! I'm SO glad you guys noticed my Bettie Page pic (Molly Ringwald was gettin' old)! She's one of my idols.

Now her little movies were definitely chick flicks!

Ellen :)

[GiGi]

Hee hee!

Betty was the bomb. Brunettes rule!
Although Marylin is the one exception :)

She was the chickiest of chicks :)

[AmyLynnBest]

Betty is great! I have a friend who knows how I love her and gets me Betty T-Shirts for every gift giving occasion. I now have about a dozen T-shirts and a long sleeve all with Betty on it.

And even though Marilyn dyed her hair, we can consider her a brunette! :D

[Ellen M.]

Bettie & Marilyn = GIRL POWER!

Gotta love those iconic, sexy chicks from the late '50's, even if the carpet didn't always match the curtains!
Ellen :)

[GiGi]

You said it gurls! How about Rita Hayworth..what a babe. No one today can touch her! Katherine Hepburn, Veronica Lake, Sophia Loren, Betty Grable, etc! Love those old movie stars...and dont get me started on the men. Hubba Hubba Gregory Peck!

[Furious D]

I've always loved Rita Hayworth, but I've always had a weakness for redheads, even fake ones.

But enough about my weaknesses...like redheads... kryptonite... holy water... and silver bullets... Let's get back on topic.

But when we're talking classic movie goddesses let's not forget Audrey Hepburn, Grace Kelly, and Lauren Bacall. They possessed what can only be described as a 'glamour' to them that the movies lost during the 60's and 70's, never to be regained.

[GiGi]

But when we're talking classic movie goddesses let's not forget Audrey Hepburn, Grace Kelly, and Lauren Bacall. They possessed what can only be described as a 'glamour' to them that the movies lost during the 60's and 70's, never to be regained

Preach it! Yes, classy dames and Lauren Bacall is still gorgeous. All Lucille Ball was awesome, goofy or not she had it. I love the hair, clothes, everything from that era. Wouldnt it be cool if men coudl still wear suits and hats and ladies gloves and hats and not be deemed dorks?

Would be cool to do a discussion on classic movies :) I love talking about that stuff and the fact there are people out there who do too :)

[AmyLynnBest]

Yes! I just watched Wait Until Dark last night.
Audrey was so beautiful and classy no matter what she did!

[Ellen M.]

Furious D,
I guess I shouldn't mention the fact that I'm a redhead... dark auburn to be exact.

Let's hear it for the bygone era of classy acting, suits, hats & gloves! I think I need to go rent some old movies!

Ellen ;)

[Furious D]

Dark auburn, eh?

Feeling dizzy... weak... room spinning... Aaaaaaaarrrrgh.....

Wait a minute....

Who put the Kryptonite in my Coke?

Aaaaaarrrrrrggghhhhh......