Question about The Godfather

[truepictures]

In the Godfather, which I've seen 45 odd times in my lifetime, there is one thing that always escapes me and it is this:

Why does Vito give the Undertaker's task (the man who starts off the movie in the presence of the Don with his dilemma) so much importance? It is obvious that the Undertaker is clueless about giving Vito respect.

Anyway, so the issue is that Vito gives less importance to Enzo, the baker, who gives him a ton of respect. But, Don Corleone gives this task "not to our paisan, give to a Jew congressman in another district."

I never understood why the undertaker wins versus the baker.

If you do, please let me know.

Thanks.

[Furious D]

Okay here's the skinny from a true Godfather trivia fiend.

The Undertaker's wife is a very close friend of Mrs. Corleone. Hence their daughter's plight is very important to the Don no matter how much of a dick the Undertaker is.

As for Enzo. The reason they don't let their 'paisan' congressman handle his citizenship case is because at the time an Italian American politician would be accused of favouritism, corruption and trying to "pollute America with 'papist' Italians." The farming out of the task to a Jewish congressman from another district avoids those accusations and any connections to the Corleones themselves.

Remember, during WW2, recent Italian immigrants to America were viewed with suspicion thanks to Mussolini and the fact that they were all Catholic in a then mostly Protestant USA. In Canada, hundreds of citizens of Italian descent were interned and their property seized. Don Corleone didn't view Enzo as less important, just that his case, with its political entanglements, required more subtlety than the simple beat down the Undertaker requested.

If you have any more Corleone questions let me know.:D

[truepictures]

That was truly one of the most satisfactory answers I've ever gotten to any question that I have asked about anything -- in my entire life.

Thank You. I don't have more questions at the moment, but I wouldn't mind if you just went all nuts with more information about the relationship of world history as part of the film.

[Furious D]

Originally posted by truepictures
Thank You. I don't have more questions at the moment, but I wouldn't mind if you just went all nuts with more information about the relationship of world history as part of the film.

Well, I don't think the Film Threat servers have enough space to hold all the crap about world history and it's connection to The Godfather. I guess the key thing in relation to the GF would be the history of immigration in America.

First came the predominantly WASP immigrants of the British colonial era. But with the coming of the industrial revolution came a raft of immigrants from Scotland and Germany at first, then the Irish fleeing the famines and British oppression. (At this time my own ancestors were forced out of Scotland to Canada to make room for sheep and the exploding wool industry.)

The Italians came a little bit later. Hence they weren't as strongly swept up in the push west as the groups that were already in America in the mid 1800's. Plus they arrived in numbers only matched by the earlier waves of Irish. And like the Irish before them they were greeted with hostility, but were allowed in as a 'necessary evil' to work in the USA's factories and mines.

By the coming of WW2 the majority of Italian Americans weren't far removed from their homeland. Most were 1st or 2nd generation Americans and they still weren't completely welcome. Mostly because of the fact that, unlike the Irish, English was not their first language and they were Catholic in a country where Protestants dominate the political scene. Remember: There has been only one Catholic American President in American history, and he got his brains blown out.

Mussolini's alliance with Hitler didn't help. The Italian American community wasn't as assimilated as the German Americans and were viewed with suspicion. Add that with the stereotypes that arose from the existence of the Mafia and things didn't look good. Hence Don Corleone's caution in the matter of Enzo the POW.

I suggest you look up Ric Burns's PBS series NEW YORK for its insight into the issues of immigration and for the history of organized crime in New York in the 30's & 40's read THE VALACHI PAPERS by Peter Maas.

[mruzick3]

Whoa! Thanks for all the info there, Furious. I'm sensing that you're either a history buff or you double majored in film and history. Well, I have one question about 'The Godfather.' It's been a constant complaint of mine....and that is, when is the entire triology, with all of its extra footage, going to be released? If you have any insights or top secret info from Zoetrope please let us all in. And keep it coming with the good historical facts....very helpful in understanding film of all genres.

_________________________
Mike Ruzicka

[Rory L. Aronsky]

I think we'd probably get that kind of Super Special Edition when Francis Ford Coppola's finances are truly in the crapper. For now, that Godfather DVD Collection they released sometime back seems like the ultimate for now.

And seeing what Paramount's DVD schedule looks like for the rest of the year, you probably won't find that sort of Special Edition this year, though they are releasing the individual Godfather films in a stripped down version with just Francis Ford Coppola's audio commentary as the main supplement. There might be one or two extras that I missed, but that's what they're going with. This is a way not only to bring more money into the till for Paramount, but they seem to be following the example that 20th Century Fox did in releasing the Alien films in individual 2-disc sets so that fans could buy the film that they want and not have to buy the entire quadrilogy.

[Furious D]

Originally posted by mruzick3
Whoa! Thanks for all the info there, Furious. I'm sensing that you're either a history buff or you double majored in film and history.

I majored in film, but I took a lot of history courses on the side, and I'm a rabid reader of history among other things.

As for the DVD, I heard that Coppola making too much money off his winery to even give a rat's ass about putting out a super duper DVD of the Godfather trilogy. It's a shame, because if there's one trilogy that just screams for the full DVD treatment it's The Godfather Saga.

[truepictures]

Dude, my uncle owns a liquor store and Coppolla's wine is cheap and it sells well. Never tried it meself, but me'h, I wanted to jump in with some of that info.

And Furious, you are indeed great with the info and book recs. Do you know JGeoff?

[Furious D]

Originally posted by truepictures
And Furious, you are indeed great with the info and book recs. Do you know JGeoff?

No. I don't think I know JGeoff, the handle doesn't ring any bells.

[ankitovich]

I'd like to recommend "Treason" by Ann Coulter.

[truepictures]

I know that Michael's son becomes an opera singer, but what about Sonny's son, the one who reads that drawing to Vito while he's just come back from the hospital.

I don't remember seeing him in GF3.

Odd.

[Furious D]

Originally posted by truepictures
I know that Michael's son becomes an opera singer, but what about Sonny's son, the one who reads that drawing to Vito while he's just come back from the hospital.

I don't remember seeing him in GF3.

Odd.

A lot of the kids were written out for GF3. Michael had 2 kids, Tom Hagen had about 4, Connie had something like 3, and by one estimate Sonny had at least 5 and maybe 6. To include all of them would've made GF3 twenty hours long at least. Coppola and Puzo decided to stick to who they considered the important ones.

The Andy Garcia character of Sonny's illegitimate son from GF3 shouldn't exist if you read the book. In Puzo's original novel Sonny's mistress was unable to have children due to a medical condition.

[truepictures]

JGeoff is actually a person who runs an unofficial Godfather info site and that's why, in 2004, I had asked you if you knew him personally, Furious.

I also wanted to see if a thread was capable of being resurrected from cache. Alright, here comes the moment of truth, I'm about to hit the submit button. Will the Godfather rise once more?

[Mark Bell]

I also wanted to see if a thread was capable of being resurrected from cache. Alright, here comes the moment of truth, I'm about to hit the submit button. Will the Godfather rise once more?
You doubt the Almighty Back Talk!?! You doubt a simple thread can be resurrected!?!

Go stand in the corner! I will talk to you after you've had some time to think about what you've done!

[Furious D]

Sheesh.

for a second there I thought someone had new questions about the Godfather.

As for JGeoff, the name still doesn't ring a bell, most of my Godfather info comes from the tradition in my family to watch the 'novel for tv' version on a massive tape collection every Christmas.

So threads can be resurrected from the dead. Maybe someone will ressurect The Famous 5 script (http://www.filmthreat.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2948).

[truepictures]

Go stand in the corner! I will talk to you after you've had some time to think about what you've done!

I know I know! I'm sorry I doubted the Almighty Back Talk! I was so impressed with the resurrection, I got chills. What else can this wonderful medium do? I'm gleeful like an infant whose lost in the Hershey's factory.

Jgeoff.com was the only Web site I used to visit for Godfather trivia. But I was re-reading this thread Furious and I saw that your knowledge made my brain tingle.

So - why not for the holidays - give us some additional information on the Godfather. Some interesting tidbits. Any hook-ups on the original set?

[Furious D]

But I was re-reading this thread Furious and I saw that your knowledge made my brain tingle.

I know that if I make part of someone tingle, I know I've done my job.

So - why not for the holidays - give us some additional information on the Godfather. Some interesting tidbits. Any hook-ups on the original set?

Oh, sheesh. I don't have anything on me right now that I haven't already covered on this thread. I am considering getting the Trilogy DVD set, but I'm still hoping that Coppola will someday relent and allow a super extended version with all the extra footage.

[GiGi]

Oh, this thread is old. Dammit.
Someone needs to start a new Godfather thread. 1 and 2 are flicks no one gets sick of.

[The Baron]

I think Sonny's son grows up and, by a freak coincidence, gets a job as a toll booth attendant on the New Jersey Turnpike.

[GiGi]

That would be irony, wouldn't it? ;)

[Seedy Edgewick]

Ask, and ye shall receive. (http://www.filmthreat.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2948)

[Furious D]

Ask, and ye shall receive. (http://www.filmthreat.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2948)

Good work.:cool:

Let's see who else takes the bait.

Though I am considering taking the characters of the Famous 5 that I created and do something with them myself.

[truepictures]

I know that Johnny Fontane was based on Frank Sinatra. Were any of the actual mobsters based on real mobsters in the Godfather? I would have really liked to be friends with Clemenza's counterpart in reality - if he had one.

[Furious D]

I know that Johnny Fontane was based on Frank Sinatra. Were any of the actual mobsters based on real mobsters in the Godfather? I would have really liked to be friends with Clemenza's counterpart in reality - if he had one.

Sadly real gangsters seem to lack the charm of Clemenza, Tessio, and Frankie Five-Angels. Vegas hood Moe Green was inspired by Bugsy Seigel and Hyman Roth was inspired by Meyer Lansky.

Real gangsters seem to act more like The Sopranos at their pettiest. Some say that show was inspired by the antics of New Jersey's DeCavalcante Family in the 90s. Those antics ended when their boss was whacked for being gay led to a wave of RICO convictions that wiped them out.

As for Sinatra/Fontaine, it was apparently a mob connected uncle who got him out of a contract with one of the big band leaders, the name of which escapes me. As for his part in From Here To Eternity which marked his movie comeback there was some opposition by the studio to him, but legend says that it was a deal with the mob to avoid union trouble and not a horse's head that got him over the hump.

[The Baron]

Were any of the actual mobsters based on real mobsters in the Godfather?

Ahem... Dere has never been any proof dat da mobsters in Puzo's book were based on real-life people. If dey were, we'd have to kill yous fa askin' da question. ;)

[Furious D]

There is also a legend about real gangsters appearing in the film. Apparently some in the crowd at the wedding scene are real mafiosi. The legend also says that Brando got drunk during the shoot and mooned some of them.

I don't know if it's true, it's just what I heard.

[truepictures]

I heard that Abe Vigoda actually travelled back in time after finishing up his latest Conan segment to film all his scenes in the movie. I also heard that it was his idea to put all the oranges in the film.

I freaking love hearsay.

[Rory L. Aronsky]

And now it's time to plug one of my favorite Internet comics, which referenced Abe Vigoda on May 6 of this past year: Alien Loves Predator (http://www.alienlovespredator.com/index.php?id=108)

[Pirate Duck]

And now it's time to plug one of my favorite Internet comics, which referenced Abe Vigoda on May 6 of this past year: Alien Loves Predator (http://www.alienlovespredator.com/index.php?id=108)

Thanks for the link, it's some funny stuff. Jesus playing for the Yankees... funny.